using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Post links to music sources and discuss music choices for shows
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:06 pm
Location: Adelaide, Sth Aust

using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby Chris N » Tue Jun 10, 2014 6:56 pm

This being my very first post I just wanted to say thanks for such an informative site, love the wealth of information that I have found on this site, thank you all.

I'm considering starting a slideshow business mainly targeting memorial slideshow work for funerals but I want to be legal when it comes to the music. Here in Australia copyrighted music is allowed to be played during a church service such as a wedding or funeral even if the service is held outside of the church, ie in a park or other venue. That's great, I'm over one hurdle but the family wants copies of the dvd slideshow to share with other family members as a rememberance which is great for me because I charge for copies but this really would be breaking copyright laws.

My plan of action against this is to purchase the music from iTunes for the customer (using a unique email and apple id on behalf of the customer). This according to iTunes support allows the purchaser to have this music file on 10 (only) devices. One is my computer to produce the slideshow in the first place and the 2nd being the dvd disc supplied to my customer to use at the funeral. This would then allow me to make 8 extra copies if needed without breaking any copyright laws. I will have a notation on the dvd cover regarding the copyright of the music and making copies of the dvd slideshow. If my customer requires more than 8 copies I can purchase the same track again using another different unique email and apple id thus giving me the right to save it to another 9 dvds.

I think

It will be a pain having to generate unique email addresses and apple id's just for this purpose but it's the only way I can figure that I'm not breaking any copyright laws.
I would love to hear your thoughts on this.


Posts: 171
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:26 pm
Location: Midwest

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby Betty » Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:09 am

It still sounds illegal to me.

Using recorded music in a show can often present copyright problems. There can be many layers of copyright in a piece of recorded music and this can make it difficult to determine whether or not a piece of music can be used as background in your show. As with image copyright, there are very few provisions that allow music to be performed without permission. Even performing music that may be out of copyright, such as Mozart, can be problematic because the sheet music may still be in copyright (if it is a new arrangement or edition) and permission will be needed from the copyright owner of the arrangement or edition.

Using an insubstantial portion of music can also be problematic as there is no clear cut definition of what constitutes “insubstantial.” Whether or not a portion is deemed to be substantial depends on how important, key, essential or distinctive the portion is to the overall work. Even a few bars can be considered substantial.

Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:06 pm
Location: Adelaide, Sth Aust

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby Chris N » Fri Jun 13, 2014 7:47 pm

Thanks Betty for your comments. Yes it does sound illegal I know. I am still waiting to hear back from APRA, the governing body here in Australia who issue licenses for music, it's been 2 days and they haven't replied to my email which makes me think this is a curly one for them. I will post again when I have their answer.
Thanks again for your comment.

Posts: 237
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:31 pm
Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby PhotoMill » Sat Jun 14, 2014 4:33 pm

Please keep us posted on what you find out. Here in Ontario, Canada, the funeral association buys a blanket license to cover any music made via DVD (memorial) but allows only a certain number of square feet per room. In other words, the music cannot be heard in the hallway of the funeral home, only the room where the tribute is to be played. This iTunes license that you speak of has not been known to me but stuff like this changes on a daily basis so your final input will be most valuable.

Best of luck...
Tax me...
I'm Canadian, eh?

Canon 50D & 70D, Epson 4990 Scanner, Epson R1800 printer
Lumapix, Paint Shop Pro X6, ProShow Producer 9
Video Studio Pro X5

Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:54 am

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby texbrandt » Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:58 pm

With all due respect what you are proposing is a smoke and mirrors trick, in the end you are selling something you don't own. I suspect that somewhere in the fine print you will find that itunes allowing 10 copies of a purchased song probably means that the copies must be on devices you own and are under your control.
If the music in question is actually incorporated in the show on a dvd that you sell then there is a copyright violation regardless of how many licenses to listen you purchase. It probably wouldn't matter if you gave the dvd's away with the music on them, there would still be a copyright violation.
Ask yourself how you would feel if the family bought one dvd from you and made a couple of dozen copies for friends and family, not really any different from using music for which you don't own a license.
I do hope you find a way to incorporate appropriate music into your memorial dvds.

"Seeking questions for life's persistent answers."

User avatar
Posts: 2234
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 8:19 am
Location: UK

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby trulytango » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:07 am

I would not rely on copies to earn a fee. I would simply create the show and provide the customer with a range of file formats. Let's face it, everyone knows someone who can copy files to various devices, including burning quality video files to DVD, so the thing is to charge properly for your time in creating the show itself, including the cost of any music you download on behalf of the customer, generate the files and then move on.

When I create pre-Wedding/Rehearsal shows or Memorial Tributes I routinely create just one DVD in very simple packaging, whilst on another device such as USB stick or SD Memory card I supply an ISO image file from which the customer can create a 'replacement' DVD (should they require it), plus a single high quality video file suitable for uploading or storing on DVD (for archive purposes) or playing directly on most modern TV sets.

I don't involve myself with any further copying or distribution once the product has left my hands and I've been paid for it.
Windows 7 HP 64-bit, Intel i5 2500K Quad Core, 8GB RAM, 1.0GB Ge-Force NVIDIA GTX 560i, Adobe Photoshop CS5, Producer 6 (GPU Benchmark was 336, now 324), a big old Canon 20D and a funky Canon Powershot G15

Esteemed Member
Posts: 162
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:36 am

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby Merlin_AZ » Sat Jun 28, 2014 4:24 am

Unless you have a sync license, you can't use songs on things you create.
So using songs from CDs and iTunes on your slideshow DVDs is illegal.

Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:06 pm
Location: Adelaide, Sth Aust

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby Chris N » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:21 pm

Thank you all for your comments.

According to APRA here in Australia I do require a licence to make copies, the licence is issued annually and is not cheap. After plenty of research I have come to the conclusion that to earn a fee from making copies is simply not worth it. Thank you trulytango for pointing me in the right direction, my time and effort in creating the slideshow in the first place is where the income comes from, not the copies.

User avatar
Posts: 4274
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:03 am
Location: Cedar, British Columbia

Re: using copyright music "Oh no, not again!"

Postby nannybear » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:11 am

Hi Chris! Quite awhile back I offered this song royalty free to forum members - I have also have a girlfriend who is an acoustic guitarist that writes and records beautiful music. We are in the process of offering a license per song to forum members only, just don't have it all worked out yet. You can listen to her music here:

Good luck with your projects! Cheers Jan or
Graphic Design, Essential Oils, Click and Grow gardening, Cooking and Merge Dragons - PSP latest - Adobe Creative Cloud Suite
You can find me on Facebook, come visit!!

Return to Music Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest